@z428 two things on this,
> using ad blockers again tries to fix things conveniently on the consumer side
1) #FreeCode licenses and #copyleft try to fix things conveniently on the consumer side as well. Waiting for some kind of regulation like #GDPR or #AntiTrust suites to stop companies from abusing #Adware as #Spyware would be about as effective as waiting for states to enforce protection of #SoftwareFreedom through regulation and court action. Still waiting ...
3) advertising is and has always been a dodgy way to fund anything. Chomsky and Herman's book #ManufacturingConsent (and the documentary of the same name) explained that in detail back in 1988, before the web was invented. I agree with #AdBusters that anything we can do to disrupt the ad business is a legitimate and necessary form of activism.
@strypey ... am more and more unhappy with these things turning into a culture of free(charge) mindless consumption by an increasingly large crowd on the internet which doesn't hesitate throwing in €1k for the latest iPhone but starts feeling cheated on and abused as soon as an independent web site asks for €2/month to keep their servers running. We are in a dire need to get that re-balanced somehow.
@z428 I agree that we need more experiments in funding online services. Especially when FB is estimated to cost about US$1/per/year. But:
1) making the world's knowledge available gratis, to anyone who wants to learn from it, is one of the most incredible achievements of our civilization. Not a pathology to be cured.
2) Wikipedia continues to prove that its possible to provide free access to a *very* heavily used website without putting up a paywall or using ads ...
3) web hosting doesn't cost as much as people seem to think. In the early 2000s #Indymedia sites paid about $100 a year for hosting, and In 2013, you could get hosting for a year for less than US$100:
That's twenty espresso coffees or beers at US$5 each. Businesses will those kinds of overheads have no excuse for #DataFarming their visitors. It happens to increase returns for #VultureCapitalists and corporate shareholders.
@strypey Hmmm. Not sure. I agree with your example but they seem way too black/white for my tastes. Not everyone who tries to utilize some "pay"-per-use model for getting (some) funding for an online service from its users is necessarily a vulture capitalist. Likewise, I refuse to see people browsing YouTube or similar sites for early "rips" of the latest blockbuster movie or the latest chartbreaker album to ...
@z428 I think we're talking past each other. I'm objecting to web ads and tracking. I have no problem with charging users for premium services, like #Pinboard.in, the new #FlickR, #Loomio, and so on. Also Vulture Capitalists are the people who use capital as a tool to extract value from online service companies, as described by #DougRushkoff in his #ThrowingRocks book, not the people running the services.
@strypey ... pages that matter to them in order to figure out what funding alternatives would be there and if they are willing to experiment. Not even talking (again) about conscious effort on choosing other sites and providers that align with your ethics and ideas, rather than keeping on using what you use now without second thought and use an ad blocker on that. 😉
@z428 you seem to be totally ignoring the way people actually use the web. There's no way I can help to fund every website I might one day want to visit. When I click on a result in a search engine, I have no idea what the business model of that site is. I do know that if I don't have my AdBlocker and #NoScript turned on a) my browser might crash, and b) my privacy might be invaded. Using an AdBlocker is just basic security, like using an Antivirus on Windows.
@LWFlouisa well, Discord is well known to be a social network for gamers, that just happens to take the form of a chat server. Not surprising you'd find a higher proportion of #Gamergate types there. I haven't spent much time on public #Mumble channels, but I've used it as a replacement for #Skype for voice conferences for activist tech projects. It's pretty good quality for that, and #FreeCode to boot.
@LWFlouisa absolutely. Corporate platforms have exploited a culture of collaborative creation and free sharing that emerged around early #commoning platforms, passing themselves off as being the same as community-orientated hosts like #SourceForge, #SlashDot, and #Wikipedia. It's a classic bait-and-switch.
@LWFlouisa nope. It started with #DotComBubble in the 90s, and the winners of each round of the Survivor Startup have become the next generation of #VultureCapitalists. Eg. take #AndreesonHorowitz. Andreeson co-founded #Netscape and Horowitz worked there too, before #AOL acquired it. Then they co-founded #LoudCloud, made it to #IPO, then sold its customers to #EDS, and pivoted to #Opsware, which was acquired by #HP in 2007 for US$1.6 billion.
@LWFlouisa you've mentioned these platforms a few times. I can't get to them at the moment because the VPN is not working on my laptop. Are the comments you mention provided by paid reviewers that work for the site, or by other users? I mean, what are you really paying for? Professional commentary, or just hosting?
@LWFlouisa so the comments are just from other users? Not part of the service you pay for? In which case you take your chances, just like to do on a subreddit, or the fediverse, or anywhere else you invite user comments. So I guess the trick is to keep shopping around for the platforms that happen to have attracted the most thoughtful and generous users at any given time ;)
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